criminal defense
Jeff Grant is Practicing Law Again: Announcing the Formation of GrantLaw, PLLC
Jeffrey D. Grant, Esq., GrantLaw, PLLC
43 West 43rd Street, Suite 108, New York, NY, 10036-7424, (212) 859-3512, [email protected], grantlaw.com.
Jeffrey D. Grant, Esq.
Private General Counsel/White Collar Crisis Management
Now again in private practice, Jeff is an attorney and counselor-at-law providing private general counsel, legal crisis management, and dispute strategy and management services to individuals and families, family-owned and closely-held businesses, the white collar justice community, and special situation and pro bono clients.
For over 20 years Jeff served as managing attorney of a 20+ employee law firm headquartered in New York City, and then Westchester County, NY. Among other practice areas, the firm engaged in representation of family-owned/closely held businesses and their owners, business and real estate transactions, trusts and estates, and litigation. Jeff also served as outside General Counsel to large family-owned real estate equities, management and brokerage organizations, in which role he retained, coordinated and oversaw the work of many specialty law firms, including white collar defense firms.
Link to GrantLaw, PLLC’s website…
White Collar Week with Jeff Grant, Podcast Ep. 23, The Vanishing Trial, Robert Katzberg
White Collar Week with Jeff Grant
It’s the Isolation that Destroys Us. The Solution is in Community.
Podcast Ep. 23, Guest: The Vanishing Trial, with Robert Katzberg
Today on the podcast we have Bob Katzberg, a dean of the White Collar Bar who has seen it all as both a federal prosecutor in the EDNY and as a criminal defense trial lawyer.
I was so taken with Bob’s book, The Vanishing Trial, that I sent it to every single one of our White Collar Support Group members currently serving in prison. In it, Bob explains how and why the Federal criminal justice system went from 10% of all cases being tried before juries to less than 2% of all cases now being tried before juries. And how the cards are now stacked against defendants, forcing them into plea bargains.
If you, a friend, family member, colleague or client are being prosecuted for a white collar crime, or any crime, this episode is a must-watch or listen-to.
So, coming up. Bob Katzberg. The Vanishing Trial. On White Collar Week. I hope you will join us. – Jeff
Listen on Apple Podcasts:
Listen on Spotify:
Listen on SoundCloud:
Watch on YouTube:
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If you have a friend, family member, colleague or client with a white collar justice issue, please forward this post; they can reach us anytime – day or night! Our contact info: http://prisonist.org/contact-us.
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Guests on this Episode:
Robert Katzberg
Robert Katzberg, a cum laude graduate of George Washington University Law School and a member of its Law Review, began his career as a law clerk to the Honorable Oliver Gasch on the United States District Court for the District of Columbia. He then served as an Assistant United States Attorney for the Eastern District of New York, where his prosecution of political corruption and financial crimes earned him the coveted Attorney General’s Special Achievement Award. For the next four decades, as a partner in Kaplan & Katzberg, a white collar criminal law boutique, he defended clients in high-profile cases in New York City and throughout the country. A Southern District of New York federal prosecutor described him as “the best cross-examiner” he had ever seen, and as a “formidable adversary” who “commands the courtroom.” Mr. Katzberg is now consulting counsel to Holland & Knight, an international law firm. He and his wife, Leslie, now live in Southern California.
Contact Information:
Purchase The Vanishing Trial on Amazon, link here.
[email protected]
https://www.hklaw.com/en/professionals/k/katzberg-robert
Also, Forbes: Walt Pavlo’s review of Bob’s book, The Vanishing Trial. Link here.
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You can find all episodes of our podcast “White Collar Week with Jeff Grant” on our website prisonist.org, our Facebook page, Podbean, YouTube (video), SoundCloud, Apple Podcasts, Spotify, LinkedIn, Instagram and Twitter.
Information About our White Collar Support Group…
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Click image for interview
Info on SBA PPP & EIDL Loan Fraud:
Entrepreneur’s #4 Most Viewed Article of 2020: I Went to Prison for SBA Loan Fraud – 7 Things to Know When Taking COVID-19 Relief Money: by Jeff Grant, J.D., M.Div.. Link to article here.
The Philadelphia Inquirer: Steal Money from the Feds? First, Meet Jeff Grant, an Ex-Con who Committed Loan Fraud, by Erin Arvedlund: Link to article here.
Hannah Smolinski YouTube: Thinking About PPP Fraud?: Hannah Interviews Jeff Grant About Going to Prison for SBA Loan Fraud. Link to article and YouTube video here.
CFO Dive: After Serving Time, Fraudster Cautions Against PPP, Other Emergency Loans, by Robert Freedman. Link to article here.
Fraud Stories Podcast with Mark Lurie: SBA/PPP Loan Fraud with Guest: Jeff Grant. Link to podcast here.
Forbes: As Law Enforcement Pursues SBA Loan Fraud, Jeff Grant Talks Redemption, by Kelly Phillips Erb. Link to article here.
Taxgirl Podcast: Jeff Grant talks Desperation and Loans in a Time of Crisis with Kelly Phillips Erb on Her Podcast. Link to article and podcast here.
Business Talk with Jim Campbell: Jeff Grant Talks with Jim About Going to Prison for SBA Loan Fraud and What to Know When Taking Coronavirus Relief Money, Biz Talk Radio Network, Broadcast from 1490 AM WGCH Greenwich, CT. Listen on YouTube here.
Babz Rawls Ivy Show: Babz Rawls Ivy & Jeff Grant Talk SBA / PPP Loan Fraud and 7 Things to Know Before You Take Coronavirus Relief Money, WNHH 103.5 FM New Haven. Watch on YouTube here.
White Collar Week with Jeff Grant, Podcast Ep. 21: All Things SBA, PPP & EIDL, with Guest: Hannah Smolinski, CPA, Virtual CFO: Link here.
White Collar Week with Jeff Grant, Podcast Episode 09: Small Business Edition, with Guest Kelly Phillips Erb. Link here.
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Louis Reed/Babz Rawls Ivy PSA:
Some very kind words from my dear friends Louis L. Reed and Babz Rawls Ivy in this brief PSA. Thank you Louis and Babz! – Jeff
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All Episodes:
Link here to Podcast Ep. 22: The Goddess, with Guest: Babz Rawls Ivy
Link here to Podcast Ep. 21: All Things SBA, PPP & EIDL, with Guest: Hannah Smolinski, CPA, Virtual CFO
Link here to Podcast Ep. 20: Reinventing Yourself After Prison, with Guests: Glenn E. Martin & Richard Bronson
Link here to Podcast Ep. 19: Insider Trading Charges Dismissed, with Guest: Richard Lee
Link here to Podcast Ep. 18: Is Your Life a Movie? The Producers, with Guests: Lydia B. Smith, Bethany Jones & Will Nix
Link here to Podcast Ep. 17: #TruthHeals, Systemic Abuse & Institutional Reform with Guest: Vanessa Osage, feat. Guest Co-Host Chloe Coppola
Link here to Podcast Ep. 16: Politicians, Prison & Penitence, with Guest: Bridgeport, CT Mayor Joseph Ganim
Link here to Podcast Ep. 15: A Brave Talk About Suicide, with Guests Bob Flanagan, Elizabeth Kelley, & Meredith Atwood
Link here to Podcast Ep. 14: Recovery & Neighborhood, with Guest: TNP’s Tom Scott
Link here to Podcast Ep. 13: Everything but Bridgegate, with Guest: Bill Baroni
Link here to Podcast Ep. 12: The Truth Tellers, with Guests: Holli Coulman & Larry Levine
Link here to Podcast Ep. 11: Blank Canvas, with Guest: Craig Stanland
Link here to Podcast Ep. 10: The Ministers, with Guests: Father Joe Ciccone & Father Rix Thorsell
Link here to Podcast Ep. 09: Small Business Edition, with Guest: Taxgirl Kelly Phillips Erb
Link here to Podcast Ep. 08: The Academics, with Guests: Cathryn Lavery, Jessica Henry, Jay Kennedy & Erin Harbinson
Link here to Podcast Ep. 07: White Collar Wives. with Guests: Lynn Springer, Cassie Monaco & Julie Bennett. Special Guest: Skylar Cluett
Link here to Podcast Ep. 06: Madoff Talks, with Guest: Jim Campbell
Link here to Podcast Ep. 05: Trauma and Healing when Mom goes to Prison, with Guests: Jacqueline Polverari and Her Daughters, Alexa & Maria
Link here to Podcast Ep. 04: One-on-One with Tipper X, with Guest: Tom Hardin
Link here to Podcast Ep. 03: Compassionate Lawyering, with Guests: Chris Poulos, Corey Brinson, Bob Herbst & George Hritz
Link here to Podcast Ep. 02: Substance Abuse & Recovery During COVID-19, with Guests: Trevor Shevin & Joshua Cagney
Link here to Podcast Ep. 01: An Evening with Our White Collar Support Group, with Guests: 16 Members of Our White Collar Support Group
Link here to Podcast Ep. 00: White Collar Week with Jeff Grant: What is White Collar Week?
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Jeff Grant
What is the White Collar Justice Community?
Welcome to White Collar Week with Jeff Grant, a podcast serving the white collar justice community. It’s the isolation that destroys us. The solution is in community.
If you are interested in this podcast, then you are probably already a member of the white collar justice community – even if you don’t quite know it yet. Our community is certainly made up of people being prosecuted, or who have already been prosecuted, for white collar crimes. But it is also made up of the spouses, children and families of those prosecuted for white collar crimes – these are the first victims of white collar crime. And the community also consists of the other victims, both direct and indirect, and those in the wider white collar ecosystem like friends, colleagues, prosecutors, defense attorneys, judges, law enforcement, academics, researchers. Investigators, mitigation experts, corrections officers, parole & probation officers, reentry professionals, mental health care professionals, drug and alcohol counselors – and ministers, chaplains and advocates for criminal and social justice reform. The list goes on and on…
Our mission is to introduce you to other members of the white collar justice community, to hear their very personal stories, and hopefully gain a broader perspective of what this is really all about. Maybe this will inspire some deeper thoughts and introspection? Maybe it will inspire some empathy and compassion for people you might otherwise resent or dismiss? And maybe it will help lift us all out of our own isolation and into community, so we can learn to live again in the sunshine of the spirit.
Along the way, I’ll share with you some of the things I’ve learned in my own journey from successful lawyer, to prescription opioid addict, white collar crime, suicide attempt, disbarment, destruction of my marriage, and the almost 14 months I served in a Federal prison. And also my recovery, love story I share with my wife Lynn Springer, after prison earning a Master of Divinity from Union Theological Seminary in NYC, pastoring in an inner city church in Bridgeport CT, and then co-founding with Lynn in Greenwich CT, Progressive Prison Ministries, the world’s first ministry serving the white collar justice community. It’s been quite a ride, but I firmly believe that the best is yet to come.
So I invite you to come along with me as we experience something new, and bold, and different – a podcast that serves the entire white collar justice community. I hope you will join me.
Blessings, לשלום
Jeff
Rev. Jeff Grant, J.D., M.Div. (he, him, his)
Co-founder, Progressive Prison Ministries, Inc., Greenwich CT & Nationwide
Co-host, The Criminal Justice Insider Podcast
Host, White Collar Week
Mailing: P.O. Box 1, Woodbury, CT 06798
Website: prisonist.org
Email: [email protected]
Office: 203-405-6249
Donations (501c3): http://bit.ly/donate35T9kMZ
Psychology Today: https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/therapists/jeff-grant-woodbury-ct/731344
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/revjeffgrant
not a prison coach, not a prison consultant
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Thank you for listening to White Collar Week.
Please subscribe, rate and review the podcast if you loved it – it helps others suffering in silence find us if they need us!
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Follow White Collar Week on Social:
Web: https://prisonist.org/white-collar-week
Facebook: https://facebook.com/whitecollarweek
Twitter: https://twitter.com/whitecollarweek
Instagram: https://instagram.com/whitecollarweek
LinkedIn: https://linkedin/whitecollarweek
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Follow Jeff Grant on Social:
Web: https://prisonist.org
Facebook: https://Facebook.com/revjeffgrant
Twitter: https://twitter.com/revjeffgrant
Instagram: https://instagram.com/revjeffgrant
LinkedIn: https://linkedin/revjeffgrant
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Want to be a guest on the Show? Have a connection you’d like to make?
Email us! [email protected]
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Credits:
Host: Jeff Grant, J.D., M.Div.
Production: Chloe Coppola
Audio Engineering: George Antonios: https://georgeantonios.com
Video Engineering: Todd Nixon
Art Direction: Greyskye Marketing, LLC: https://greyskye.com
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It’s the Isolation that Destroys Us. The Solution is in Community.
Progressive Prison Ministries, Inc. is the world’s first ministry supporting the white collar justice community. Founded by husband and wife, Jeff Grant and Lynn Springer in Greenwich CT in 2012, we incorporated as a nonprofit in Connecticut in 2014, and received 501(c)(3) status in 2015. Jeff has over three decades of experience in crisis management, business, law (former), reentry, recovery (clean & sober 17+ years), and executive and religious leadership. As Jeff was incarcerated for a white-collar crime he committed in 2001, he and Lynn have a first-hand perspective on the trials and tribulations that white-collar families have to endure as they navigate the criminal justice system and life beyond.
Progressive Prison Ministries, Inc. is nonsectarian, serving those of all faiths, or no faith whatsoever. To date we have helped over three hundred fifty (350) individuals, and their families, to accept responsibility for their actions and to acknowledge the pain they have caused to others. In accordance with our commitment to restorative justice, we counsel our members to make amends as a first step in changing their lives and moving towards a new spiritual way of living centered on hope, care, compassion, tolerance, empathy and service to others. Our team has grown to over ten people, most with advanced degrees, all of whom are currently volunteering their time and resources.
Progressive Prison Ministries’ goal is to provide spiritual solutions and emotional support to those who are feeling alone, isolated, and hopeless. We have found that these individuals are suffering from a void but are stuck, and don’t know what to do about it. Our objective is to help them find a path to a healthy, spirit-filled place on the other side of what may seem like insurmountable problems. Many of those we counsel are in a place where their previous lives have come to an end due to their transgressions. In many cases their legal problems have led to divorce, estrangement from their children, families, friends and support communities, and loss of a career. The toll this takes on individuals and families is emotionally devastating. White-collar crimes are often precipitated by other issues in the offenders’ lives such as alcohol or drug abuse, and/or a physical or mental illness that lead to financial issues that overwhelms their ability to be present for themselves and their families and cause poor decision making. We recognize that life often presents us with such circumstances, sometimes which lead us to make mistakes in violation of the law.
All conversations and communications between our ordained ministry, and licensed clinical relationships, and those we serve fall under state privilege laws. This is one reason that attorneys often allow and encourage their clients to maintain relationships with us while in active prosecution or litigation situations.
If you, a friend, family member, colleague or client are suffering from a white collar criminal justice issue or are experiencing some other traumatic or life-altering event, and would like to find a path to a healthy, spirit-filled place on the other side of what seems like insurmountable problems, please contact us to schedule an initial call or appointment.
Copyright 2021, All Rights Reserved, Progressive Prison Ministries, Inc.
Entrepreneur: I Went to Prison for S.B.A. Loan Fraud: 7 Things to Know When Taking COVID-19 Relief Money: by Jeff Grant, J.D., M.Div.
Don’t let desperation cloud your judgment.
Opinions expressed by Entrepreneur contributors are their own.
In the months after 9/11, I was frantic.
But my fears had less to do with the tragedy at the Word Trade Center and more to do with the fact that, after 10 years of rampant prescription opioid abuse, my business was failing. I was searching desperately for an out. Meanwhile, the television and radio were blaring with ads for 9/11 FEMA loans administered by the U.S. Small Business Administration.
So, on an especially bad day, I lied.
I said I had an office near ground zero. I received the SBA loan I requested, and immediately paid down the personal credit cards I had run up while waiting for the SBA money. Even so, the loan did little to stop my spiral into drug addiction, mental health issues, marital problems and magical thinking.
In 2002, I resigned my law license and started on the road to recovery. But it all caught up with me about 20 months later, when I was arrested for the misrepresentations on my loan application. I served almost 14 months at a Federal prison for wire fraud and money laundering.
My objective in writing this piece is to offer some insight on what business owners should consider before they take out disaster loans. Certainly, the majority of people requesting these loans are honest and upstanding entrepreneurs who have immense need for the aid, and will use the funds properly. I am very glad there is help for them. That said, history has shown us again and again that when people are in dire need, they’re more prone to make impulsive, ill-advised decisions. My hope is that sharing my experience will help others avoid the consequences I faced. Here are seven takeaways.
1. Desperate people do desperate things.
There were thousands of fraud prosecutions after 9/11, Hurricane Katrina, Superstorm Sandy, and so on. Why? Whether because of overwhelming business issues, poor personal judgment, or just plain bad luck, people were wounded, desperate and willing to do anything, anything, to stop the bleeding. But if the wound is too deep, a Band-aid is not sufficient.
Practice point: In any situation, behaving desperately is unlikely to save your business.
2. Beware of the belief that rules are suspended in times of emergency.
The government is advertising that huge amounts of money are available to save our businesses. I recently sat in on a webinar run by a very reputable business consulting group that recommended that attendees get their SBA disaster loan applications in immediately, regardless of the facts or the actual needs of their business — they said we could always modify our applications prior to taking the money. State unemployment websites are actually giving instructions, in writing, on how to mislead and circumvent the system in order to get approved. Don’t take the bait! If you default two years from now, this “good-meaning advice” won’t matter to prosecutors.
Practice point: Be truthful at all times.
3. Beware of magical thinking.
This is a tough one because entrepreneurs are inherently optimistic. We believe that things will always be better tomorrow than they are today. It drives us, makes us successful, informs our risk-taking. But in times of trauma, that voice can be an entrepreneur’s worst enemy. Does this sound familiar? We have learned the hard way that there is no shortcut, and yet we desperately want there to be one right now.
Practice point: Instead of immediately reaching for a bailout or other quick fix, develop a good solid business plan. Maybe a disaster loan will fit into this plan; maybe it won’t.
4. This paradigm shift will affect all small to mid-size businesses.
We are in the midst of a massive reordering that has already had a huge effect on small and mid-sized businesses. Business owners are being called to closely examine if our business models are still viable, or if we must pivot to new ways of doing things. Example: the Swiss watch industry completely missed the shift to digital watches. Have we waited too long to have a robust online presence? Are our products or services even needed anymore? Have we been holding on by a thread for years, unwilling or unable to look at the hard facts?
Practice point: Get real, now. Don’t borrow money to save a business that can’t be saved.
5. Be cautious when borrowing from the government.
As is the case with any loan, the devil is in the details. The terms and covenants in the loan documents dictate what you can or can’t do with the money once you get it. You can only use the funds for the purposes you stated in your application — that is, to pay operating expenses of the business to keep it afloat until it starts bringing in sufficient revenue again. You (and your spouse) will probably have sign for the loan personally, and will probably have to pledge all available collateral, including a second (or third) mortgage on your house. If you maxed out your personal credit cards while anticipating your disaster relief funding, you can’t use the money to pay off your cards.
Practice point: Read the terms and covenants of the loan closely. Whatever the loan terms say to do, do, and whatever they say don’t do, don’t do. No exceptions.
6. We can’t save our businesses and our lifestyles at the same time.
Here’s the big trap. We have mortgages, car payments, school tuitions, and other personal expenses that have to be paid, and soon. But simply put, SBA loans are meant to save your business, not your lifestyle. Discuss all your options with advisors and friends you trust — ones that will tell you the truth! It’s like going to the doctor. Your diagnosis will only be as accurate as the history you provide. These are trying times, with a triage system designed to be more expeditious than thorough.
Practice point: There is no such thing as a free lunch. Borrowing money comes with responsibility and accountability.
7. Get acquainted with acceptance.
I hope we are all great entrepreneurs who can figure out ways to make our businesses survive and flourish. But let’s face it. Some of our businesses will not make it, even with the infusion of government funds. What should we do? We can pare down, embrace change and do things differently as we start a new chapter. Never forget that there will always be opportunity to start again, and to live a fuller, more abundant life.
Practice point: Sometimes less is way, way more!
Reprinted from Entrepreneur.com, link here.
Jeff Grant, J.D., M.Div. is Co-Founder of Progressive Prison Ministries, Inc., the world’s first ministry serving the white collar justice community. The ministry hosts an online White Collar Support Group every Monday night. After an addiction to prescription opioids and serving almost fourteen months in a Federal prison for a white-collar crime he committed when he was a lawyer, Jeff started his own reentry — earning a Master of Divinity from Union Theological Seminary in the City of New York with a focus in Social Ethics.
Jeff has over three decades of experience in crisis management, business, law (former), reentry, recovery (clean & sober 17+ years), public speaking and corporate training. Sometimes referred to in the press as “The Minister to Hedge Funders,” he uses his experience and background to guide individuals, families and organizations forward in their lives, relationships, careers and business opportunities, and to help them to stop making the kinds of decisions that previously resulted in loss, suffering and shame.
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More on SBA PPP & EIDL Loan Fraud:
The Philadelphia Inquirer: Steal Money from the Feds? First, Meet Jeff Grant, an Ex-Con who Committed Loan Fraud, by Erin Arvedlund: Link to article here.
Fraud Stories Podcast with Mark Lurie: SBA/PPP Loan Fraud with Guest: Jeff Grant. Link to podcast here.
Forbes: As Law Enforcement Pursues SBA Loan Fraud, Jeff Grant Talks Redemption, by Kelly Phillips Erb. Link to article here.
Taxgirl Podcast: Jeff Grant talks Desperation and Loans in a Time of Crisis with Kelly Phillips Erb on Her Podcast. Link to article and podcast here.
Business Talk with Jim Campbell: Jeff Grant Talks with Jim About Going to Prison for SBA Loan Fraud and What to Know When Taking Coronavirus Relief Money, Biz Talk Radio Network, Broadcast from 1490 AM WGCH Greenwich, CT. Listen on YouTube here.
Babz Rawls Ivy Show: Babz Rawls Ivy & Jeff Grant Talk SBA / PPP Loan Fraud and 7 Things to Know Before You Take Coronavirus Relief Money, WNHH 103.5 FM New Haven. Watch on YouTube here.
Also: White Collar Week with Jeff Grant, Podcast Episode 09: Small Business Edition, with Guest Kelly Phillips Erb. Link here.
POSTPONED: Jeff Grant will be Speaking at the Michigan State University White Collar Crime Conference, East Lansing, Mich., May 28 & 29, 2020
Michigan State University White-Collar Crime Conference
2020 White-Collar Crime Conference, May 28th and 29th
The College of Social Science and the School of Criminal Justice at Michigan State University invite you to attend the 2020 White-Collar Crime Conference, to be held May 28th and 29th at the Kellogg Hotel and Conference Center in East Lansing, Michigan. This two-day conference will feature the diverse perspectives of speakers from academia, industry and law enforcement, as well as formerly incarcerated individuals.
A limited number of rooms have been reserved at the Kellogg Hotel for conference attendees at a special conference room rate. The conference website will be active in early January 2020 – conference registration and hotel bookings can be made through the site once active.
Location
Kellogg Hotel and Conference Center – Big Ten C Room
219 South Harrison Road
East Lansing, MI 48824
Hotel
Kellogg Hotel and Conference Center
219 South Harrison Rd.
East Lansing, MI 48824
517-432-4000
Conference code: 2005WHITEC
Double occupancy: $117.00/night plus taxes
(This rate is available until May 1st, 2020)
Conference participants may book using this rate for the following nights: May 27th, 28th & 29th
Registration & Information Link: Here
Pre-registration only (due to meal commitments)
- Student: $25.00
- Register HERE.
- Faculty, Law Enforcement, non-profit: $75.00
- Register HERE.
- CPE (15 hours): $350.00
- Register HERE.
Registration includes the following:
- All conference materials
- Parking for May 28th and 29th in the Kellogg Center parking garage
- Morning and afternoon snacks on both days
- Lunch both days
Speakers and further details will be posted as information becomes available.
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Jeff Grant, J.D., M.Div. is an ordained minister with over three decades of experience in crisis management, business, law, reentry, recovery (clean & sober 17+ years), and executive & religious leadership. Sometimes referred to in the press as “The Minister to Hedge Funders,” he uses his experience and background to guide people faithfully forward in their lives, relationships, careers and business opportunities, and to help them to stop making the kinds of decisions that previously resulted in loss, suffering and shame.
After an addiction to prescription opioids and serving almost fourteen months in a Federal prison for a white-collar crime he committed when he was a lawyer, Jeff started his own reentry – earning a Master of Divinity from Union Theological Seminary in the City of New York with a focus in Christian Social Ethics. He is Co-Founder of Progressive Prison Ministries, Inc., the world’s first ministry supporting the white collar justice/economy exiled community. Jeff is the first person in the United States formerly incarcerated for a white collar crime to be appointed as CEO of a major criminal justice organization.
As an ordained minister, conversations and communications between Jeff and those he serves fall under clergy privilege laws. This is one reason that attorneys often allow and encourage their clients to maintain relationships with Jeff while in active prosecution or litigation situations.